Yin Wood Snake and Self-combining pillar

[johnyqi]

I have one question, been going through those self-combining pillars and I find hard to understand why Yin Wood Snake is not qualified as one?

A good comparison would be a Yin Earth self-combining with Pig (Yang Wood). It seems to me like an identical setup.

Jlim, would you mind to clarify this one for me?

[The-Monk]

Pig is Hai Water. The Yang Jia Wood is supported and well looked after by the water. This is like the a guy who is interested in a girl, and the guys family supports the guys interest in pursuiing this particular girl.

The Snake, is Bing Fire. The Yang Metal, has every intention to combine with the Yin Wood in the Stem, cannot for whatever the reason Bing Fire wants. This is like Romeo and Juliet In short, Bing Fire is the Family Fued (doesn't matter which side really; but assume male side). The Yang Metal is Romeo, and Yin Wood is Juliet. But neither can go against the say of the most important (and strongest) influence: Bing Fire, which does not let Geng Yang Metal do anything it doesn't want. Therefore, it cannot combine like the rest despite it's desire to do so.

All together:
Ji (Yin Earth) over Hai (Pig Water): Ji Earth with Jia Wood. Wood is strong as it is supported by the main element, not an issue.
Ding (Yin Fire) over Hai (Pig Water): Ding Fire with Ren Water. Water is strong as it is the main element itself, not an issue.
Yi (Yin Wood) over Si (Snake Fire): Yi Wood wants to combine with Geng Metal. Metal is weak and subdued within by Fire, unable to combine.
Xin (Yin Metal) over Si (Snake Fire): Xin Metal wants to combine with Bing Fire. Fire is strong as it is the main element itself, not an issue.
Gui (Yin Water) over Si (Snake Fire): Gui Water wants to combine with Wu Earth. Earth is strong as it is supported by the main element, not an issue.

In short, it still combines (because it has every itention to do so). But also doesn't (because it can't get past Bing Fire who's in the way).

[JLim]

Hi johnyqi, good to have you back!

Yi (Yin Wood) over Si (Snake Fire): Yi Wood wants to combine with Geng Metal. Metal is weak and subdued within by Fire, unable to combine.

In short, it still combines (because it has every intention to do so). But also doesn't (because it can't get past Bing Fire who's in the way).

That is correct and well-explained!  Thank you, The-Monk!

[johnyqi]

Thank you @The-Monk , that was a very extensive explanation. I guess Metal behaves always a little bit different because it doesn't have direct support through resources like other elements.

Now, this is another topic, I also noticed that quite often Yang and Yin Metal DM can be totally weak, on the paper, but still have a highly functional chart. Is it possible that Metal, in general, doesn't need so many resources as other elements?

For example, I was looking at Bradley Cooper's chart, absolutely no support for Yin Metal, not even in LP, but chart works fine. And I saw many examples like this.

[JLim]

Wow  , the chart that you just attached is an Officer Commanding Wealth structure, so he can be very wealthy.  This structure is only recognized in Mangpai.

There is some discussion on this structure in 💲💲💲 WARREN BUFFETT - HOW HE'S SUPER WEALTHY BASED ON MANGPAI BAZI 💲💲💲

[johnyqi]

yeah, I guess he is wealthy, successful and famous :-)

so basically Yang Fire is doing the main work here, controlling water and producing wood, and is also unstable, which means charisma. Yin Metal's strength is irrelevant. Great chart indeed,

[Dao]

Pig is Hai Water. The Yang Jia Wood is supported and well looked after by the water. This is like the a guy who is interested in a girl, and the guys family supports the guys interest in pursuiing this particular girl.

The Snake, is Bing Fire. The Yang Metal, has every intention to combine with the Yin Wood in the Stem, cannot for whatever the reason Bing Fire wants. This is like Romeo and Juliet In short, Bing Fire is the Family Fued (doesn't matter which side really; but assume male side). The Yang Metal is Romeo, and Yin Wood is Juliet. But neither can go against the say of the most important (and strongest) influence: Bing Fire, which does not let Geng Yang Metal do anything it doesn't want. Therefore, it cannot combine like the rest despite it's desire to do so.

All together:
Ji (Yin Earth) over Hai (Pig Water): Ji Earth with Jia Wood. Wood is strong as it is supported by the main element, not an issue.
Ding (Yin Fire) over Hai (Pig Water): Ding Fire with Ren Water. Water is strong as it is the main element itself, not an issue.
Yi (Yin Wood) over Si (Snake Fire): Yi Wood wants to combine with Geng Metal. Metal is weak and subdued within by Fire, unable to combine.
Xin (Yin Metal) over Si (Snake Fire): Xin Metal wants to combine with Bing Fire. Fire is strong as it is the main element itself, not an issue.
Gui (Yin Water) over Si (Snake Fire): Gui Water wants to combine with Wu Earth. Earth is strong as it is supported by the main element, not an issue.

In short, it still combines (because it has every intention to do so). But also doesn't (because it can't get past Bing Fire who's in the way).

Thank you very much @The-Monk for your generosity!!!

Happy New Chinese Year

 

[Gmuli]

Pig is Hai Water. The Yang Jia Wood is supported and well looked after by the water. This is like the a guy who is interested in a girl, and the guys family supports the guys interest in pursuiing this particular girl.

The Snake, is Bing Fire. The Yang Metal, has every intention to combine with the Yin Wood in the Stem, cannot for whatever the reason Bing Fire wants. This is like Romeo and Juliet In short, Bing Fire is the Family Fued (doesn't matter which side really; but assume male side). The Yang Metal is Romeo, and Yin Wood is Juliet. But neither can go against the say of the most important (and strongest) influence: Bing Fire, which does not let Geng Yang Metal do anything it doesn't want. Therefore, it cannot combine like the rest despite it's desire to do so.

All together:
Ji (Yin Earth) over Hai (Pig Water): Ji Earth with Jia Wood. Wood is strong as it is supported by the main element, not an issue.
Ding (Yin Fire) over Hai (Pig Water): Ding Fire with Ren Water. Water is strong as it is the main element itself, not an issue.
Yi (Yin Wood) over Si (Snake Fire): Yi Wood wants to combine with Geng Metal. Metal is weak and subdued within by Fire, unable to combine.
Xin (Yin Metal) over Si (Snake Fire): Xin Metal wants to combine with Bing Fire. Fire is strong as it is the main element itself, not an issue.
Gui (Yin Water) over Si (Snake Fire): Gui Water wants to combine with Wu Earth. Earth is strong as it is supported by the main element, not an issue.

In short, it still combines (because it has every itention to do so). But also doesn't (because it can't get past Bing Fire who's in the way).

There is long topic in the other forum with Mang Pai translation... And in one of the examples it seems much of the material is connected to Wu/Zi self combining pillar.

The pillars listed here, however, seems to be all of the potentially self combining pillars that have the yang stem in their hidden stems. Suggesting the branch is initiating it. Also same idea can come from the idea of the problem with the environment in the Fire>Metal case.

And of course Wu/Zi isn't listed as Gui is yin.

But if that is the case, then there is very interesting idea about branches initiating relations to the stems, something that many people would expect to be in reverse(stems initiating relation to the branches).

Not a question really, as that is waste of time lately, just a pointer for members that are trying to understand the examples in that translation and maybe what was viewed here more clearly. : )

[JLim]

But if that is the case, then there is very interesting idea about branches initiating relations to the stems, something that many people would expect to be in reverse(stems initiating relation to the branches).

Good observation and I see your point, but I don't look at these self-combining pillars as the Branch initiating the relation.  I look at both Stem and Branch in such pillar as one unit. 

[Flyingkite]

Thank you @The-Monk , that was a very extensive explanation. I guess Metal behaves always a little bit different because it doesn't have direct support through resources like other elements.

Now, this is another topic, I also noticed that quite often Yang and Yin Metal DM can be totally weak, on the paper, but still have a highly functional chart. Is it possible that Metal, in general, doesn't need so many resources as other elements?

For example, I was looking at Bradley Cooper's chart, absolutely no support for Yin Metal, not even in LP, but chart works fine. And I saw many examples like this.

In classical bazi Xin needs to adjust climate to be effective.